Aaron Anderson: Well I hear you saying that leadership has maintained a very steady path through this, but I have to believe that pace of change; there's so much that has happened in the industry, that maybe there is some unsettledness, maybe in the employee body, certainly we have had some reductions, our business has changed, we have had a lot of attrition, a lot of folks move on to other things. Have you seen the culture change from the old Ma Bell type culture, to a more aggressive type company, one that is perhaps kind of not quite as stable in the employees own feelings. Have you seen that, and if so, what have you seen leaders do with regard to that?

Marty Dickens: Aaron, that's a very good question, and yes I have seen all of that, all those things happen; we had to change. Remember, we were THE telephone company, well, with the breakup, it started changing in '84, and then with the rewrite of the act in '96, it really started changing around us, and we had to go from a company that basically was like Henry Ford with the Model T, you could get any phone you wanted as long as it was a black one, we had to become a company that provided. We already were on our way to this since '84, but we had to become more and more a company that anticipated, or tried to anticipate, successfully what customers needed, both residential and business customers in order to do all the things they wanted to. Customers want the latest, no matter what it is; you know how we all are, whether it's the latest little cell phone, or the latest DVD player, or any of those things that are out there. We always want the latest in technology services, and we want it right now, and we don't want to know all the stuff behind the scenes: we want it to work, we want it to give us the quality of service we want, we want it at the speed we want it, and when we as a consumer seek those things, if we don't get them, we are going to go somewhere that we can, because we are going to hear about someone else getting it somewhere. So, we had to go from a passive marketing company to an aggressive marketing company. So, this change has really been good for the Bell system, and it's definitely been good for consumers in America , there is no doubt about that, it's just that we've had some wrinkles, or some valleys along the way or policy caused problems. But by changing that culture, it also meant that we had to become even more efficient, and we had to be more aggressive in how we conducted ourselves, and we had to be right up to the edge of the wave all along the way in order to be successful, and offer products and services at competitive prices. So when you change that culture, it definitely changes from the old Ma Bell company where employees really came and worked and they were here for all their careers, alright? That is not the way it is in corporate America these days. It certainly isn't that way any longer in the Bell companies, or a company like Bellsouth. Yes, we want people to come, and decide this is the place I want to have a career and stay, but the dynamics have changed and people come in and they get experience, and they learn some stuff here, and then they go somewhere else. People also want a lot greater opportunity to determine where they work, and what they do, and their time away from the job is very important, and that is an important element, and it should be. So, we have changed how we operate, the downside of that is it has also changed the number and structure of our corporation as you know, and the situation there is: any time any one person has to leave the company before they want to leave the company, it is not a good day, it is a sad day, and unfortunately, we have had a lot of that, or too much of that over the last 3 or four years. But the only thing you can do there, as sad as that is, and as unfortunate as that is, is you have to look at that as “those sacrifices are being made, those business decisions are being made for the greater good of the overall corporation and the employees that are still here”. So, while it is a sad thing to do, a hard thing to do, it becomes a necessary thing to do in order to get the business structured correctly, and to deal with the downturns in the economy and the unfavorable policy that happens to be out there. So the culture has changed, but I think it is for the better.

Aaron Anderson: I have to believe that when we see these larger spans of control, we see managers perhaps in more ambiguous situations, things aren't as . . . I wouldn't say it was programmed, but when it was Ma Bell, you did things by the book, there wasn't a lot of variety, and I have to believe that leaders today have to be more effective in negotiating with their employees, with outside vendors, with their customers, so there's got to be a different style there.

Marty Dickens: . . .and all of us have to be more agile and be able to make decisions more quickly, and as you said, you don't turn to the practice. You know I remember someone I admired greatly who has retired now was the President of Southern Bell before he retired, a guy by the name of Frank Skinner. I remember sitting in a meeting with him one day, and someone made an announcement, he was getting a little readout from those of us around the table, and someone said “we are doing X”, and he said “why are we doing X?”. The person said “I know it seems a little strange, but that is what the procedures say we do”, and he said “well we are going to stop doing X”. He said “I want to offer a piece of advice”, Frank was very much a gentleman, very bright, and he said “I will offer a piece of advice: rules are from when brains have run out”. So, you know, if we are trying to do the right thing, and we are being ethical, and we are dealing with integrity, we are going to make good decisions, and you don't have to turn to some practice to determine what to do. I think the thing we have all recognized all along through the history of the Bell system, and certainly now in these tenuous times, the most important asset we have, and I mentioned this very briefly earlier when I said: the most important thing other than employees is customers, the most important asset we have in this company are the employees. Everybody has technology, we happen to be a big company, and we can raise some capital to do some things, and we've been successful, so we are established, but if it wasn't for the commitment to excellence by our employees, every day, at every level, at every job, none of this would work. I always give the analogy, because of my simple way of thinking about it from sports analogy at work, it's like a football team. Steve McNair is a great, great quarterback for the Titans, and we all like to see him throw those long passes, we like to see Derek Mason catch them, we like to see those thing happen, but not many of us can tell you who that right guard is on that offensive line, right?

Aaron Anderson: Right.

Marty Dickens: Well, you take that right guard out of the lineup and you say “ya'll go out there with ten guys and pull this off”, they are not going to get very far are they? Because that linebacker is going to come through that hole every single time, nearly before McNair can get the snap, so to me that says, it's an analogy that I can see and envision, that is why every single employee is so important, and it has to be an environment where they know that they are important, it's not about rank, it's not about title, it's about hey you are part of the team, and your contribution, your ideas are all important to the success along the way, and that no one person has all the answers.

Aaron Anderson: So that communication comes not only from the top, but from every supervisor employee relationship, one on one.

Marty Dickens: You want it to be that way, we strive for it to be that way. That's not to say we don't mess up sometimes, but that is the course that we operate in, or try to operate in, it's recognizing the worth of the individual, and how important they are in our overall success, and that there is no employee in this company that isn't important: if they weren't important, we don't need to have that job, and they are important as human beings anyway, so even if you have to say to them “you know, we are going to have to change your job”, or even if you have to take ANY action relative to an employee, whether it be discipline or otherwise or give them a poor appraisal because of their performance, you should be seeking ways to help improve that, but at no time should you ever do anything that is going to damage the self esteem of that person. You can tell them, you can constructively work with them; you can give them a poor appraisal, you can tell them they are going to have to leave the company, but you explain why, and what the steps are that need to be taken, but you don't have to damage the individual if you can afford it, but for the body of employees it's very important for them to know that you care about them, that they know from our Chairman, all the way down, they are cared about, and how important they are to the success of Bellsouth.